Please keep the other posts on topic. Use this for talking about whatever you want to talk about.
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H. M. Brough
5 years ago
Kushal’s on the Urbane Cowboys Podcast! A good antidote to the usual India-bashing we get in the press.
Bengalistani
5 years ago
Congratulations to indians from a Bangladeshi for a significant achievement in science and technology (though i am not optimistic about the future of science in South Asia)❤
“though i am not optimistic about the future of science in South Asia”
But why? Considering our low GDP per capita all across S-Asia , that we still do some scientific stuff in south asia is of significant value. I see some upshots in all S-Asian countries. Bangladesh for example, the youngest and the rapidly catching up (and beating us all). Sri Lanka with relative high HDI even with a civil war. Nepal with arguable the most progressive constitution. etc .
Compared to our poverty rates rivaling that of parts of Africa, we are not doing that bad.
Milan Todorovic
5 years ago
Aryans’ descendants today:
1) The 4th International Olympiad of Metropolises 2019 – Belgrade got the silver medal overall (gold – Moscow, St. Petersburg, Shanghai) and individual golds in mathematics, physics, chemistry and silver in informatics. Congrats.
2) After 3000 years, Aryans grandchildren are back to China (Hindustan was not their exclusive ancient destination!!!) for gold. Keep fingers crossed, hiccups will not stop them. Dreaming team, hold on. One-minute highlights:
Does the latest paper render the terms ANI and ASI incoherent?
Any of the links to your blog page regarding this @razib?
Numinous
5 years ago
I think there’s a bug in the “Reply” function. Sometimes my replies don’t follow the comment I replied to, and appear on the main thread instead.
Anyone else seeing this?
This was just at the second level, I think (reply to a reply). I’ll watch out for a recurrence.
(It’s not that big a deal. With the 5-min edit option, I can add an address to a person if I need to.)
Ruthvik
5 years ago
So, I visited India (Hyderabad) after 4 years. I took my GF (US) with me. It was not a pleasant experience. Things have become expensive but you don’t feel like giving away so much money for so crappy goods/service that you get (barring the women’s shopping). Every archaeological site has foreigner fee (It’s ridiculous!!). I think they simply should charge more VISA fee and rip ’em off at once so that the tourists won’t feel ripped off every time they visit something. All the historical sites are decently maintained but as soon you exit the site you will see the wrath of the common Indian man in the form of litter and touting. My gf was saying, “It’s sad to see such nice places littered and not cared for!!”. There are lot of beautiful/historical sites in India but it is almost not worth the fight to get there. My own mother (who’s a govt teacher) and my cousin (who’s a state bureaucrat) threw a chocolate wrapper out of the bus as soon as they were done. When confronted, they said, “This is India, deal with it!!”. Silver lining of the story is that I didn’t see anyone openly defecating or openly peeing in public places. Shockingly, virtually every Indian home will be clean (even the one slums).
Indian American member of US house of representatives, Pramila Jayapal, epresses concern about the human rights situation in Jammu and Kashmir.
Ilhan Omar, another congresswoman also expresses concern about – what else – the same. When was the last time this lady expressed concern about human rights in any Muslim majority country ?
Answer: Never. She is more concerned about Momin rights than human rights.
Our brief argument over whataboutism comes to mind 🙂
FWIW, I consider what’s going on in Kashmir to be an abomination, and leading India down a very dark path (the less-noticed NRC is another.) I have neither a favorable impression of Muslim countries nor do I give a rat’s ass for what goes on there, so there’s no point guilt-tripping me about those places.
Saurav
5 years ago
“Indian American member of US house of representatives, Pramila Jayapal, epresses concern about the human rights situation in Jammu and Kashmir.”
As I said earlier, the Hindu demography will be split down the middle. Between the woke, “not dependent on Hindu groups”, left wing, coconut folks like Jaypal, Ro Khanna and the more traditional, religious , Hindu plus Hinduatva folks.
Scorpion Eater
5 years ago
@Razib. I would like to know where do you stand on gun rights and abortion rights.
moderate pro-abortion rights (skeptical of 3rd-trimester) and not super invested in the gun debate tbh (not a major issue for me, i think both sides make more of it than it warrants)
Interesting. Now I wonder on what ground do you even self-describe yourself as a conservative.
But don’t bother to reply. May be a discussion for later times. What I found surprising was that you consider gun control as a not-a-major-issue-for-me. To me, this is *the* issue that will decide if I bring up my only child in US or India.
It breaks my heart when she comes from school and elaborately describes the lock-down drill they had in school as a defense against some active shooter being present in the school. My mind wanders off to the carefree childhood I had in India. Yes, I didn’t have a car in my childhood and just a tiny black&white TV for entertainment, but we were so free! And these kids, growing up paranoid wrecks in the land of free!…
OK, ignore more. Friday night, and this is just scotch talking…
I, by the way, am a bleeding heart liberal. no apologies.
I’m sure it’s quite distressing to witness so many school shootings, but schoolkids in India aren’t much “freer” these days than American schoolkids, compared to what you or I experienced back in the day. I’ve heard schools have metal detectors in the States now? I think you’ll find the same in places like Delhi (ostensibly for terrorist attacks.) If you do relocate, you’ll not have to contend with school shootings thankfully, but you and your kids will find a whole host of other problems to deal with. (Don’t take my word for it though; I don’t have kids and haven’t had to deal with school and stuff.)
Milan Todorovic
5 years ago
This topic probably requires a dedicated thread, there will be a lot of discussions. This is one of yet taboo topics from ancient SA history. There is still a strong resistance by some circles in India to recognise existence of Aryans and their migration to SA region. A new moment is that some individuals recognise Aryans existence, but they see them as primitive barbarians without any culture who even did not know for agriculture.
We should prove that it is very opposite from the truth and that Aryans culture was at the world highest level at that time and that strongly enriched SA region, especially the future India, where was inbuilt in the core of their identity up to these days. As a beginning, I nominate MAHABHARATA.
Among lots of legends, most known to people, is ancient India epos Mahabharat. It contains 200 thousand lines of verses in 18 books. In one of them ‘Forest’ saint sources, rivers and lakes are described. Rivers and lakes of the country called by epic ‘Bharata’, i.e. land of Da’Aryans and H’Aryans. The largest river of Central Russia – Volga till 2nd c.BC was called Ra, in the Avesta was called ‘Ranha’, in Rig Veda and Mahabharata ‘Ganges’.
Ancient Indian legends call Yamuna the only large tributary of Ganges (Volga), flowing from south-west, what corresponds modern Oka. Tributaries of Oka and rivers of Volga-Oka basin have got names: Yamna, Yam, Ima, Imyev, Yaran (Sunny, Light), Urga (Light Movement), Sura (Sunny) Alatyr (Saint Stone), Lama (Spiritual teacher), Moksha (Enlightenment) and others. According to texts of ancient India, second name of the river Yamuna was Kala, and till nowadays estuary of Yamuna is called by the locals as estuary of Kala.
In Rigveda and Mahabharata other large rivers and towns are mentioned. Thus, not far from river head of Yamuna (Oka) there is a river head of Sindhu (in Sanskrit – flow, sea) – modern Don, flowing to the East and South and falling into Red Sea (how Black Sea was called by ancient tribes). On the coast of this Sea nation Sindi was leaving and there was situated town Sind (Anapa). Town Manusha correlates with modern Moscow, town Rama geographically corresponds Kolomna, Sita-to Serpukhov, Shiva-to Ryazan, Soma-to Suzdal, Vamana – to Murom and others.
Kushal’s on the Urbane Cowboys Podcast! A good antidote to the usual India-bashing we get in the press.
Congratulations to indians from a Bangladeshi for a significant achievement in science and technology (though i am not optimistic about the future of science in South Asia)❤
“though i am not optimistic about the future of science in South Asia”
But why? Considering our low GDP per capita all across S-Asia , that we still do some scientific stuff in south asia is of significant value. I see some upshots in all S-Asian countries. Bangladesh for example, the youngest and the rapidly catching up (and beating us all). Sri Lanka with relative high HDI even with a civil war. Nepal with arguable the most progressive constitution. etc .
Compared to our poverty rates rivaling that of parts of Africa, we are not doing that bad.
Aryans’ descendants today:
1) The 4th International Olympiad of Metropolises 2019 – Belgrade got the silver medal overall (gold – Moscow, St. Petersburg, Shanghai) and individual golds in mathematics, physics, chemistry and silver in informatics. Congrats.
2) After 3000 years, Aryans grandchildren are back to China (Hindustan was not their exclusive ancient destination!!!) for gold. Keep fingers crossed, hiccups will not stop them. Dreaming team, hold on. One-minute highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RYI-lWpazA
3) He is old but still strong and sexy. I see him as an image of his Aryans ancestors. Ana is a special story, too.
Moscow Nights – Dmitri Hvorostovsky, Ana Netrebko (4 min)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5SlUmCdXf0
4) World Champions now European Champions, too (2 min).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-Vvh_Vyolg
Does the latest paper render the terms ANI and ASI incoherent?
Any of the links to your blog page regarding this @razib?
I think there’s a bug in the “Reply” function. Sometimes my replies don’t follow the comment I replied to, and appear on the main thread instead.
Anyone else seeing this?
num, i think it’s when it nests too far? i am not a big fan of ‘reply’ but the readers seem to like it…
This was just at the second level, I think (reply to a reply). I’ll watch out for a recurrence.
(It’s not that big a deal. With the 5-min edit option, I can add an address to a person if I need to.)
So, I visited India (Hyderabad) after 4 years. I took my GF (US) with me. It was not a pleasant experience. Things have become expensive but you don’t feel like giving away so much money for so crappy goods/service that you get (barring the women’s shopping). Every archaeological site has foreigner fee (It’s ridiculous!!). I think they simply should charge more VISA fee and rip ’em off at once so that the tourists won’t feel ripped off every time they visit something. All the historical sites are decently maintained but as soon you exit the site you will see the wrath of the common Indian man in the form of litter and touting. My gf was saying, “It’s sad to see such nice places littered and not cared for!!”. There are lot of beautiful/historical sites in India but it is almost not worth the fight to get there. My own mother (who’s a govt teacher) and my cousin (who’s a state bureaucrat) threw a chocolate wrapper out of the bus as soon as they were done. When confronted, they said, “This is India, deal with it!!”. Silver lining of the story is that I didn’t see anyone openly defecating or openly peeing in public places. Shockingly, virtually every Indian home will be clean (even the one slums).
This is what happens when people develop an ego before they develop good habits. (Warning to those who are cheering on Modi and Co.)
https://scroll.in/latest/937056/kashmir-two-us-lawmakers-urge-india-to-end-communication-blockade-release-detained-individuals
Indian American member of US house of representatives, Pramila Jayapal, epresses concern about the human rights situation in Jammu and Kashmir.
Ilhan Omar, another congresswoman also expresses concern about – what else – the same. When was the last time this lady expressed concern about human rights in any Muslim majority country ?
Answer: Never. She is more concerned about Momin rights than human rights.
Ilhan Omar is dumb af.
Our brief argument over whataboutism comes to mind 🙂
FWIW, I consider what’s going on in Kashmir to be an abomination, and leading India down a very dark path (the less-noticed NRC is another.) I have neither a favorable impression of Muslim countries nor do I give a rat’s ass for what goes on there, so there’s no point guilt-tripping me about those places.
“Indian American member of US house of representatives, Pramila Jayapal, epresses concern about the human rights situation in Jammu and Kashmir.”
As I said earlier, the Hindu demography will be split down the middle. Between the woke, “not dependent on Hindu groups”, left wing, coconut folks like Jaypal, Ro Khanna and the more traditional, religious , Hindu plus Hinduatva folks.
@Razib. I would like to know where do you stand on gun rights and abortion rights.
moderate pro-abortion rights (skeptical of 3rd-trimester) and not super invested in the gun debate tbh (not a major issue for me, i think both sides make more of it than it warrants)
Interesting. Now I wonder on what ground do you even self-describe yourself as a conservative.
But don’t bother to reply. May be a discussion for later times. What I found surprising was that you consider gun control as a not-a-major-issue-for-me. To me, this is *the* issue that will decide if I bring up my only child in US or India.
It breaks my heart when she comes from school and elaborately describes the lock-down drill they had in school as a defense against some active shooter being present in the school. My mind wanders off to the carefree childhood I had in India. Yes, I didn’t have a car in my childhood and just a tiny black&white TV for entertainment, but we were so free! And these kids, growing up paranoid wrecks in the land of free!…
OK, ignore more. Friday night, and this is just scotch talking…
I, by the way, am a bleeding heart liberal. no apologies.
I’m sure it’s quite distressing to witness so many school shootings, but schoolkids in India aren’t much “freer” these days than American schoolkids, compared to what you or I experienced back in the day. I’ve heard schools have metal detectors in the States now? I think you’ll find the same in places like Delhi (ostensibly for terrorist attacks.) If you do relocate, you’ll not have to contend with school shootings thankfully, but you and your kids will find a whole host of other problems to deal with. (Don’t take my word for it though; I don’t have kids and haven’t had to deal with school and stuff.)
This topic probably requires a dedicated thread, there will be a lot of discussions. This is one of yet taboo topics from ancient SA history. There is still a strong resistance by some circles in India to recognise existence of Aryans and their migration to SA region. A new moment is that some individuals recognise Aryans existence, but they see them as primitive barbarians without any culture who even did not know for agriculture.
We should prove that it is very opposite from the truth and that Aryans culture was at the world highest level at that time and that strongly enriched SA region, especially the future India, where was inbuilt in the core of their identity up to these days. As a beginning, I nominate MAHABHARATA.
Among lots of legends, most known to people, is ancient India epos Mahabharat. It contains 200 thousand lines of verses in 18 books. In one of them ‘Forest’ saint sources, rivers and lakes are described. Rivers and lakes of the country called by epic ‘Bharata’, i.e. land of Da’Aryans and H’Aryans. The largest river of Central Russia – Volga till 2nd c.BC was called Ra, in the Avesta was called ‘Ranha’, in Rig Veda and Mahabharata ‘Ganges’.
Ancient Indian legends call Yamuna the only large tributary of Ganges (Volga), flowing from south-west, what corresponds modern Oka. Tributaries of Oka and rivers of Volga-Oka basin have got names: Yamna, Yam, Ima, Imyev, Yaran (Sunny, Light), Urga (Light Movement), Sura (Sunny) Alatyr (Saint Stone), Lama (Spiritual teacher), Moksha (Enlightenment) and others. According to texts of ancient India, second name of the river Yamuna was Kala, and till nowadays estuary of Yamuna is called by the locals as estuary of Kala.
In Rigveda and Mahabharata other large rivers and towns are mentioned. Thus, not far from river head of Yamuna (Oka) there is a river head of Sindhu (in Sanskrit – flow, sea) – modern Don, flowing to the East and South and falling into Red Sea (how Black Sea was called by ancient tribes). On the coast of this Sea nation Sindi was leaving and there was situated town Sind (Anapa). Town Manusha correlates with modern Moscow, town Rama geographically corresponds Kolomna, Sita-to Serpukhov, Shiva-to Ryazan, Soma-to Suzdal, Vamana – to Murom and others.